I’m glad I made a convincing case lol, ty for reading 😀
Tbh I have a hard time coming up with a solid idea of what might happen. I guess I’m leaning towards the group, or most of the group depending on whether anyone dies or what Casca does when she wakes up, sticking together. It would feel too repetitive if everyone died again or left to do their own subplots and Guts was back to Black Swordsmaning alone imo. Like granted there’s a complication with the armour potentially taking over now, but even so there’s not a lot of drama or intrigue you can wring out of that. Guts is the Beast of Darkness, eventually someone brings him back to himself again, snore. Like unless that someone is Griffith i’m already bored by the idea bc we’ve seen it like 4 times already.
I could maybe see them parting ways temporarily for plot reasons, splitting up to accomplish different things, but I don’t think Farnese, Serpico, Casca, Schierke, Puck, or Isidro are going to be written out of the story anytime soon. I think they’re here til the end, or close to it.
I could easily see Magnifico, Roderick, the knight dude, and the mermaid dying or taking off though. They’ve all had way less development and time and energy spent on their narratives.
Though I also wouldn’t be surprised to be proven wrong, bc yk, anything
could happen when Casca gets her mind back and I’m prepared to be
surprised by whichever direction we end up going in.
consider: guts, a teenager (? how old was he at this point in canon? young anyway) just killed a man in cold blood and accidentally killed a child (not a thing he does in either case, at this point) for griffith, then is wounded and hits his head
… this is somehow the first time I noticed he hits his head that hard and probably has a concussion at this point…
has just hallucinated his childhood traumas with himself in a villain roll, staggers in and asks immediately for griffith
at this point he must be delirious to some extent and he’s just focussed on finding griffith to report, but I think also for comfort? to be told he did the right thing, he did well, it’s all okay
(and what happens is he overhears that stupid conversation while still fucking concussed and oh my god berserk is PAIN)
yeah this was one of the worst sequences in the entire manga lol at the end all this he was just so needy and just wanted to talk to griffith so bad. like the first thing he did was he went looking for him and he completely ignored casca when she started asking him questions
and then he sees finds griffith but he’s with charlotte and guts fucking. makes this expression
and just proceeds up the stairs. when casca stops him he flinches and again look at his face
then griffith delivers his speech and:
like. highkey fucking hate this chapter and my only consolation is that griffith knows this is where he hurt guts because:
would griffith actually know what they were talking about, though? his reaction suggests something like that, but it could also suggest him thinking something else was happening between guts and casca that night, or that guts had told casca what he’d done for griffith? then again I haven’t gotten to this chapter in the manga yet ha
but holy shit yes this is one of the most painful things in the manga and the way guts has this semi-concussed expression the whole time jada’dad’adjlk’’ ow
oh! sorry for the spoilers then fdkjsdf
but, after that casca says
so i think if griffith remembers his own speech he should know what they’re talking about, though it is possible that he doesn’t
lol the majority of fandom thinks he and femto are exactly the same, i’m pretty sure this corner of tumblr is in the minority.
and yes femto is obviously created from a part of griffith, I don’t think anyone thinks he’s a wholly new character created out of thin air, it’s just a question of where you draw the line. i differentiate between them because they have different personalities and different dominant drives and different motivations (like I don’t think Femto/NeoGriff is motivated by guilt anymore). griffith contained femto, just as guts contains the beast of darkness, but the rest of griffith is gone, or frozen now (give or take a few suggestive bthumpy hints that a part of him still remains buried in femto/neogriffith.)
Also I should let you know that I personally believe blaming the fetus was just NeoGriffith’s way of continuing to deny his actual feelings. I don’t think the fetus actually has much of anything to do with NeoGriffith’s current emotional state, and while I may be proven wrong, I would be very disappointed if I am. So we’re unlikely to agree on that point.
(here are two posts about the neogriffith fetus issue, if you’re interested in more of an explanation)
And I think NeoGriffith is going to keep being a genial, very likeable king tbh. He’ll keep expanding Falconia, welcoming all people to live as equals there, and the majority of Midland and wherever else he expands to are probably going to love him. Any political backlash would be pretty easily quelled – the nobles don’t really have a leg to stand on, they’re vastly outnumbered, and Griff has been declared a saint or w/e and is going to be crowned by the head of the holy see, plus he can’t be harmed by ordinary humans, so I don’t think there’s much they can do even if they resent him.
I’d like to see them sowing some seeds of emotional turmoil for NeoGriffith by reminding him of his life before the Eclipse, maybe moreso now that Rickert has kind of pointed some shit out to him that he couldn’t deny, but I can’t see them affecting the plot much at this point. I mean, maybe if Guts shows up and they help him, but that would be kind of weird lol, and I don’t really see that happening.
Yeah, I’d say whether Femto is a different person from Griffith comes down to semantics and what someone considers personhood, but to me undergoing a magical transformation that augments the “evil” in your heart (which, in Berserk, exists in the hearts of all people) and removes the “goodness” or w/e, as visually depicted by literally losing fragments of himself:
makes you different enough that I have no problem mentally separating human Griffith and Femto, and definitely don’t hate Griffith for Femto’s actions, same way I don’t hate Guts for trying to murder his friends when the armour takes over.
If you (general you) wanna hate Griffith for agreeing to sacrifice his friends, or challenging Guts when he left, or w/e, I’ll disagree but I think that’s fair game. But hating him for Femto’s actions after we’re taken step by step through his magical transformation into an entity made out of evil really doesn’t make sense to me.
Also, do you mean Griffith would’ve taken Guts back if he’d returned, say, a year after the duel, like in canon, but Griffith hadn’t gotten caught fucking Charlotte and therefore hadn’t spent that year in a dungeon?
I think Griffith probably would take him back, because he’s desperate and needy and irrational and in love, but I could see an argument where the duel is a big wake-up call to how emotionally compromised he is by his love for Guts, which could make him view Guts as a huge threat lol, and he might refuse to let him return to try to protect himself from his own destructive, dream-endangering feelings.
Though I think it’s also likely that Griffith isn’t that self aware even after the duel, and would still manage to deny his feelings. Like Guts would come back and Griffith would somehow logic himself into returning to their close relationship without admitting to himself that he just really needs Guts in his life. Like, “it’s not because I desperately want him back at my side, it’s because he knows I assassinated the queen and co and therefore I need him as my ally and not my enemy.” Or something along those lines. Though of course his feelings would be that much harder to deny now, and eventually something would have to give.
Or he could be aware of his feelings now, but too far gone to refuse Guts, a la “if I can’t have him, I don’t care!” Like, “ok Guts’ existence could clearly ruin me, but fuck it, he came back and I’ll be damned if I’m letting him leave me again ever.” Which would open its own associated emotional can of worms lol.
lol sorry I love thinking about Griffith’s stupid feelings and how he deals or doesn’t deal with them.
(And now I’m wondering what if Guts turned around and walked back two minutes after leaving Griffith in the snow. I feel like if that was the case Griffith would be incapable of anything but genuine emotional expression, either in the form of being overwhelmed with relief that Guts came back and immediately taking him back, or rage followed by a sobbing breakdown or smthn.
This is a great topic to muse on lol)
I wonder if, if Guts turned around and walked back, if Griffith would be too vulnerable for relief/rage? Like, Guts just almost left, and Griffith made a fool out of himself by completely letting his emotions get the best of him. I feel like anger, pride, and just plain exhaustion might stop him from acting up again, although … they also might not, damn, I don’t think we can know for sure.
Idk the way he falls to the snow and stares into space, unable to even pretend he’s okay for the Hawks who are just standing there awkwardly, personally has me thinking it’s a v rare moment where he’s not capable of self-control. I’d give it maybe a few minutes before he smiles, stands up, and pretends “it’s nothing,” but if Guts caught him before that point I think his reaction would be raw af.
though there’s def some wishful thinking here because it’s a reaction I’d love to see even if I don’t think I can completely picture it.
If Guts caught him after he put the mask on again I think his reaction could be very different. Maybe angry and prideful, maybe something like, “you won your freedom, so gtfo,” something indicating an “i don’t want your pity” kinda feeling, idk. but i’m just throwing headcanons at the wall lol, like I could see a lot of different reactions as ic depending on how it’s depicted.
Yeah, I’d say whether Femto is a different person from Griffith comes down to semantics and what someone considers personhood, but to me undergoing a magical transformation that augments the “evil” in your heart (which, in Berserk, exists in the hearts of all people) and removes the “goodness” or w/e, as visually depicted by literally losing fragments of himself:
makes you different enough that I have no problem mentally separating human Griffith and Femto, and definitely don’t hate Griffith for Femto’s actions, same way I don’t hate Guts for trying to murder his friends when the armour takes over.
If you (general you) wanna hate Griffith for agreeing to sacrifice his friends, or challenging Guts when he left, or w/e, I’ll disagree but I think that’s fair game. But hating him for Femto’s actions after we’re taken step by step through his magical transformation into an entity made out of evil really doesn’t make sense to me.
Also, do you mean Griffith would’ve taken Guts back if he’d returned, say, a year after the duel, like in canon, but Griffith hadn’t gotten caught fucking Charlotte and therefore hadn’t spent that year in a dungeon?
I think Griffith probably would take him back, because he’s desperate and needy and irrational and in love, but I could see an argument where the duel is a big wake-up call to how emotionally compromised he is by his love for Guts, which could make him view Guts as a huge threat lol, and he might refuse to let him return to try to protect himself from his own destructive, dream-endangering feelings.
Though I think it’s also likely that Griffith isn’t that self aware even after the duel, and would still manage to deny his feelings. Like Guts would come back and Griffith would somehow logic himself into returning to their close relationship without admitting to himself that he just really needs Guts in his life. Like, “it’s not because I desperately want him back at my side, it’s because he knows I assassinated the queen and co and therefore I need him as my ally and not my enemy.” Or something along those lines. Though of course his feelings would be that much harder to deny now, and eventually something would have to give.
Or he could be aware of his feelings now, but too far gone to refuse Guts, a la “if I can’t have him, I don’t care!” Like, “ok Guts’ existence could clearly ruin me, but fuck it, he came back and I’ll be damned if I’m letting him leave me again ever.” Which would open its own associated emotional can of worms lol.
lol sorry I love thinking about Griffith’s stupid feelings and how he deals or doesn’t deal with them.
(And now I’m wondering what if Guts turned around and walked back two minutes after leaving Griffith in the snow. I feel like if that was the case Griffith would be incapable of anything but genuine emotional expression, either in the form of being overwhelmed with relief that Guts came back and immediately taking him back, or rage followed by a sobbing breakdown or smthn.
This is a great topic to muse on lol)
You should have known. This is the man I am. You of all people.
@chaoticgaygriffith@yesgabsstuff lol you mentioned me but tbh my opinion on this topic is basically exactly what you’re discussing in the comments so, +1
i guess one thing i can throw out tho is that
I kinda think on a narrative level the whole sequence from Guts waking up from his nightmare and then thinking of Griffith with this look in his eyes
to Griffith winning and Guts looking at him with the same look in his eyes
tells us that
there’s attraction between Guts and Griffith that can’t be
straightforwardly acted on because of their histories.
Like Guts clearly already wants Griffith’s attention despite getting uncomfortable and pissed off when he gets it, and the fact that instead of just walking away he proposes a bet where if he wins he can stab Griffith and if he loses he has to stay with him in a maybe sexual way, and either way they get to get up close and personal with swords and roll around in the grass for a while, seems pretty telling to me.
Idk basically I think Guts subconsciously wants to stay with Griffith and keep
Griffith’s attention on him despite his discomfort, I think attraction
and sexuality seeps into their exchange because, well, it’s there, and I
think rape comes in because that’s what Guts thinks of when he thinks of
men and sexuality (and thanks to the nightmare its on his and the audience’s minds),
and it’s brought up bc it’s a complication that keeps that attraction subconscious and sublimated.
Casca makes fun of Guts for being protective of her, assures she can still watch his back.
Charlotte appears. Casca is reminded of her feelings for Griffith and says they’re the same, still.
Casca immediately clings to Guts, to sublimate her feelings of jealously and longing for Griffith. She has Guts, at least, in this way she can’t have Griffith. It’s the same for Guts, when he runs ahead after realising how vulnerable Griffith has been with him and literally leaves Casca behind.
They cling to each other while looking for Griffith because he is what they are both ultimately focussed on.
in addition to danny’s biblical evidence lemme add that in both dantes divine comedy and miltons paradise lost lucifer = satan, so even if the bible didn’t already explicitly say it, one could draw the conclusion from those works which is tbh where 99% of the cultural understanding of satan and his goals personality etc comes from because there’s actually very little about satan even said in the bible.
v good point.
i mean yeah even if miura is referencing lucifer somewhere i’m very sure it would be the popular conception of him. plus the holy see seems p catholic in particular, speaking of popular conceptions.
i dont know what this post is referencing (why the diff matters) but *whips out bible* lucifer and satan is the same, lucifer was the name of the angel that thought it’d be cool if he could be equal to or greater than god and satan literally just translates to “the adversary” in hebrew. the adversary as in “that douchebag whomst name we no longer say”. again. dont know why this was relevant but i was forced to be baptist for over a decade, mise well whip out tha know
yeah since the anon mentioned an
occult demonology cult
i feel like this is v much a matter of different interpretations of the bible lol. the context was just whether griffith is a version of satan/lucifer/whatever. but ty i’m just kind of going with the flow and i figure this is the more popular interpretation miura would’ve drawn on for any potential christian references.
Honestly I would enjoy more political scheming, Griffith assassinating everyone was one of my favourite parts of the Golden Age. Though NeoGriffith is too invulnerable to make it fun for the same reasons now probably.
you're the only one 